Welcome to the intersection of faith in the culture. This is Wobbler's Live. Thanks for joining us today. We're diving right back in today to biblical citizenship in modern America. As you know, if you're a listener to Wobbler's Live, we're always looking at the hot topics of the day from a biblical historical and constitutional perspective.

This week, we're really combining all three as we bring you this biblical citizenship course. The course, by the way, has exploded across the country. If you want to know more, go to biblicalcitizens.com. You can sign up as a coach for free. You can host classes for free. You can pick up the DVDs and the workbooks at Wobbler's.com. There's so many great things in this course. I really encourage you to take it. You know, if you have to take it by yourself, that's fine. But it's much more fun to bring people over into your living room or get people together at the church. The interaction that takes place after you play the videos, that's the most powerful part.

So check it out at Biblicalcitizens.com. But for now, let's just pick up right where we left off yesterday with biblical citizenship in modern America. By the time you have a House and Senate debate, and by the time you see if you can get 38 states to come together on this, this is going to be thoroughly vetted through the people. We will have had discussions extensively on this. And by the way, the notion of being able to wipe out the Constitution is such a convention and it doesn't exist. Yeah, that's a totally false principle. I mean, remember the current polling is right now nearly three quarters of the nation.

Respects the Constitution. They don't think it's a mean use right, but they respect it. So they're not going to be willing to wipe this thing out. Well, well, and specifically to that, I've heard people say, well, what if they, if you had a convention of states and they do the same thing that they did in the first, you know, the convention, it's not possible because again, it's still whatever they do has to come back to the state. It's got to come back to us and you got to have 38. That's right. And it's interesting. Article 5 actually limits that by saying amendments to this Constitution. That's right. It doesn't say you come out with a new Constitution. It says a minute.

Well, that's, you know, the original Constitutional Convention, they just met there to revise the articles of Confederation. They came up with a whole new document. No, because had that violated what the state sent them, therefore, the states would not have ratified it. The states knew that they probably could not revise the articles of Confederation. You go, try, but you know what, get us a document that gets us into a nation. And that's what they did. And it's interesting that you have examples through that process, even back in the Continental Congress, that the states were explicit with their delegates. For example, when we signed the declaration,

originally, when we were baiting the declaration, Pennsylvania told us delegates, you do not sign a separation of Great Britain. As the base went on, they changed positions. So they sent word of the delegates signed, separate from Great Britain. Well, half the delegates refused to sign individually. So the state legislature popped them all out of there, sent new ones back. That's how Benjamin Rush became a sign of the declaration. He replaced one of the guys who refused to separate like the state legislature. He told them to do. So the question of, well, what kind of delegates might Congress doesn't appoint the delegates? The states do. That's right.

And the states control the delegates. And if the delegates start doing something, the state didn't send their due. The state is calling back home. Really easy. So the history is there. I mean, history answers all this. And so again, I mean, we need to have open debates on this because it is a big issue. But this is, I'm not scared to use in the Constitution. Yeah. Use the Constitution to save the Constitution. That's right. It's not going to destroy it. That's right. That's right. So one of the major powers that states have is Article 5. It's right there in the Constitution. It is fully one seventh of the articles of the Constitution. So to forget about Article 5,

you're saying, I got six sevenths of a Constitution, which means I've got basically no Constitution at all because I have no way for it to balance and reflect the conditions of the nation. Article 5 is a power specifically to the states where they have complete control. Two thirds of the states can call a convention on a specific subject. The states meet, they meet in a convention for proposing amendments. And that's all a convention does. If a convention meets and it proposes amendments, then it goes back to the states for three force of them.

To consider whether or not to ratify it. So you've got two methods. Congress can propose amendments. The states can propose amendments. Whatever is proposed, it requires three force of the states to ratify it. There's some people out there, Rick, that think Article 5 is too dangerous. We're not good enough. We're not good enough to use the Constitution. We can't meet and discuss. We can't even have a convention. Well, I would propose that then we shouldn't have legislative committees anymore. You know, legislative committees meet. They take evidence. They discuss.

They hear witnesses and then they decide proposals that go to the legislature. If you imagine if somebody said we can't have the Transportation Committee meet anymore, they might make decisions for the whole state. Article 5 provides a committee process of the states to consider issues. Consider evidence. Consider the conditions and consider proposals. And if they agree on a proposal, they send it out to all the states to consider whether or not they want to ratify that by a three force majority. It's an incredible opportunity that we simply have made use of.

So as the states to look at how we clarify these roles and responsibilities. All right, it's time to dive into citizen activism. What do we do as citizens, as biblical citizens, to actually take action, not just talk about it. Wow, we are going to talk about it. But let's talk about what you've been actually doing. We are joined by three great Americans that are true biblical citizens. They don't just talk about it. They do it. One of our great Constitution coaches, Scarlett Lanny, is here with us.

One of our very first, I mean literally pioneering Constitution coaches with Constitutionalive in his churches in Colorado, Ken Davis. And he has been there on the front lines for years. We actually did events together more than a decade ago. He's run for office, serves on the school board, has a radio program and helps others run for office as well.

Y'all welcome Joe Messina. All right, this is our final week together. And we have been laying the foundation. We've been talking about the Constitution. We've been talking about how to be biblical citizens. Now it's time to actually take some action on these things.

A lot of people that are watching this class or maybe thinking, I might want to do that. I'm not sure if I want to do that. Ken, you were one of the pioneers. I mean, you did this before. Anybody suggested you do it. In fact, I didn't even know people were hosting classes. And you just kept coming back and saying, I need more workbooks. I need more workbooks. I'm like, why is he buying so many workbooks? And come to find out you were talking about force multiplier. You were teaching people like crazy. What gave you the idea to do that? Because we didn't even suggest it. You just did it. Yeah. So in 2012, I'm probably like a lot.

I'm sitting there and watching TV. And I keep hearing these people say, well, that's not constitutional. Well, that's constitutional. And I was going, I don't know if they're right or wrong. So I probably should find out. So I decided I was actually going to start a small group in my church learning the Constitution.

So the first couple of weeks, I was trying to design my own curriculum. Two weeks then, I go to a business conference that I attend every year. And Rick was, of course, one of the main speakers. And he's got a curriculum.

So novel. A great idea. I was like, huh. Divine a point they really was. So two weeks then, I buy a Constitutionalife and I buy a few extra workbooks. At this point, I have myself and three other people literally in a closet with a TV and a DVD player.

And we are diving in using Constitutionalife at the time. I'm so glad to see what we're doing now. And we have more people. It was you and three other people.

Me and three other people. And then a couple of them brought a friend. In fact, we have people from outside the church. And now here we are eight years later. This past Saturday, we just wrapped up our session. I've pretty much done this on average three times a year every year since 2012.

We do it in ten week blocks. Which is, that's why all the extra workbooks that I'm always ordering. And we've, we've seen amazing growth of this past session finished. We had just over 60 people participate. In fact, the church had to give me one of the smaller auditoriums to host the class in. And truly God has, has moved. And I told them this past Saturday.

Because I believe that this is what God has me doing. If it was still just four of us in a closet with a DVD player in a TV, I would still be doing this.

Amen. Amen. Yes.

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