Hello, everybody, and welcome to the Radical Canter Podcast. I'm Kim Scott, co-founder of Radical Cander

and author of Radical Cander and Just Work. I'm Amy Sandler, your host for the Radical Cander

podcast, and today we are so excited to welcome Amy Edmondson to our second radically candid conversation episode of

2023. Amy C. Edminson is the Novartis Professor of Leadership and Management at the

Harvard Business School. She's the author of several books, including the fearless organization,

creating psychological safety in the workplace for learning,

innovation, and growth. And a new book called Right, Kind of Wrong, the Science of Failing

Well, available September 5th. And according to publishers weekly, this is a book, quote,

perfectionists will find freeing, which means that I am

snuggling up to it every night for the rest of my life. Amy Edmondson from Amy Sandler and the whole

radical kindergarten team, we are so, so thrilled to have you on our show today. Thank you. I'm thrilled to be here. Yeah, Kim,

I know that you have done some work with Amy. Do you want to share a little bit about your

collaboration to date before we jump in? Sure. So Amy and I recently wrote an article together

about how people sort of misunderstand radical candor and psychological safety in ways

that are sort of very different but related.

So, Amy, tell me if I get this wrong.

But it is my perception that people often interpret radical candor as being mean, and they interpret

psychological safety as, you know, saying everything in a mean way, but they interpret psychological

safety as saying nothing as a way of being nice, and neither one is accurate. So why don't

you correct the misinterpretation of psychological safety first, and then I'll take on radical Canada.

Psychological safety is not about being nice.

And as you just said, the problem is being nice is often code for don't say what you really think.

...