A Mind-Blowing Way of Looking at Math (with David Bessis)

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4.7 • 4.3K Ratings

🗓️ 27 October 2025

⏱️ 82 minutes

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Summary

What if math isn't about grinding through equations, but about training your intuition and changing how your brain works? Mathematician and author David Bessis tells EconTalk's Russ Roberts that the secret of mathematics isn't logic--it's the way we learn to see. He explains why math books aren't meant to be read like novels, how great mathematicians toggle between images and formal proofs, and why we need a third mode of thought--"System 3"--that patiently retrains our intuition and the power of imagination. Bessis and Russ Roberts swap stories about the humility of great mathematicians, how Andrew Wiles "saw" the fix to his proof of Fermat's last theorem, and Ramanujan's dream-revelations that proved true.

Transcript

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0:00.0	Welcome to Econ Talk, Conversations for the Curious, part of the Library of Economics and Liberty.
0:07.9	I'm your host, Russ Roberts, of Sholem College in Jerusalem and Stanford University's Hoover Institution.
0:13.8	Go to EconTalk.org, where you can subscribe, comment on this episode, and find links and other information related to today's conversation.
0:21.2	You'll also find our archives with every episode we've done going back to 2006.
0:26.7	Our email address is mail at econTalk.org.
0:30.0	We'd love to hear from you.
0:36.6	Today is September 18th, 2025, and my guest is mathematician and author David Bessis.
0:43.5	His book is Mathematica, a secret world of intuition and curiosity.
0:49.6	David, welcome to Econ Talk.
0:52.0	I just wanted to say I am delighted to be here.
0:55.3	Great.
0:56.3	I want to start by saying that I hope to do a good job in this interview like I do with all interviews.
1:04.2	But if I don't do a good job, I want to tell my listeners right now that the goal of this
1:09.4	interview is to get you to read this book.
1:11.8	I've read it twice.
1:13.8	That's a big number.
1:15.9	And by reading it, I mean every word.
1:18.5	I would have read it a third time before our conversation, David, but I ran out of time.
1:23.9	I found the book electrifying, and listeners know I don't say that often.
1:28.7	So just in case we don't do justice to the book in this conversation, get the book.
1:33.2	It's sort of about math, but that's not what it's really about.
1:38.5	There's no formal math in the book.
	...

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