Hey, everybody. We got a great one today. Of course. Because Joyce Vance is with us again, one of my

all-time favorite guests, and she's joined by one of her posse, the brilliant, Barbara McQua,

Joyce and Barbara, of course, are MSNBC legal contributors. And they caught my eye on that network

and my ear.

Both are former U.S. attorneys, Joyce from the Northern District of Alabama and Barbara from the Eastern District of Michigan, both serving during the Barack Obama administration from 2010-2017.

They were both U.S. attorneys and now both law professors,

Joyce, at the University of Alabama and Barbara at the University of Michigan. And every time I hear one or both of them give their analysis of all these complex legal matters, and particularly

over this long, tortuous saga of the January

6th insurrection and the myriad of impeachments and crimes and pardons committed and extended

by Donald Trump, since we had the misfortune of his entering our daily lives. I always learn a lot when I listen to them.

What occasioned this conversation, of course, was the Fulton County grand jury wrapping up

its work on the small matter of the 2020 Georgia presidential election and the suspicion

based on hard to deny audio evidence that Trump and

others, including goons like Rudy Giuliani and Mark Meadows and quite a few others,

there were 75 people of interest called to testify to the Fulton County grand jury, that

there may be a crime or two or three or four

or five or more, I suspect, way more committed. But we don't know yet. There was a hearing this

past week presided over by a Georgia state judge. The media

and other interested parties requested that the grand jury report be released, which the judge

indicated that he might very well order, which of course Fawney Willis, the Fulton County

prosecutor, strongly took issue two.

Willis said she objected in part to protect those who may be charged in whatever case or cases

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