Welcome to the Tech Policy Podcast. I'm Evan Schwarger. On today's show, digital activism or digital slackivism? Has the internet made activism easier but less effective? Does clicking a link to sign a petition or tweeting at your local congressman actually accomplish anything?

Joining me to discuss this is Michelle Ray, founder of Clearvoter, a company that's trying to turn slackivism into activism.

Michelle, thanks for joining the show.

Thanks for having me.

And I also have to point out that Michelle has a very impressive Twitter following, and you

can follow her at Galtz Girl, which is a great Einran reference for all you libertarians

out there.

So, Michelle, what do you see as the main difference between slackivism and activism?

I think that very clearly the difference is being aware enough to pay attention to politics online and interested enough to click the retweet button and maybe go sign a petition or the share

button on Facebook, but not being willing to get off your couch and follow up on that issue

that interested you enough to take that action on social media or online.

And is there really a clear difference in how effective those things are? Because, you know, we hear congressmen and senators, you know, they'll go on TV and they'll say, oh, I'm getting a lot of comments on Facebook or, oh, my constituents are tweeting at me. I mean, it seems like they do pay attention to some online activism. But do you just see that as less effective than the hands-on approach

that was more prominent before the internet?

Well, I think that in light of how immediate reactions are online, I think that legislators

don't have much of an option anymore.

Social media is just ingrained in politics now, thanks to particularly OFA's efforts in 2008 and

their use of media and data.

They're a very effective use of media and data to get out the vote and to rally supporters to their cause.

So I think that over the last seven, eight years in particular, social media has just become a part, a tool in politics.

And I think that politicians do have to pay attention, necessarily have to mention social interaction. But I don't think that politicians do have to pay attention necessarily have to mention social interaction.

But I don't think that in most cases we can say definitively that social has an immediate

impact on the actual policymaking. So, you know, it feels good to slackivists to get together in handy little teams

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