I'm Francis Lamb and this is the splendid table from APM. There's something so satisfying about someone who knows their craft so well that, you know,

they start to feel like it's okay to not be perfect about it.

They've learned to see all the details, the techniques, and the traditions,

and they've come to a place where it's not about being the best or perfect. It's about knowing that all a human endeavor is flawed,

but you can be great all the time and every once in a while you hit on something sublime.

That could be how you might describe

Chef Ashley Shanti and her fried fish for instance.

She's the author of a new cookbook, Our South,

Black Food Through My Lens. and we'll talk to her later in the show.

And we're going to start with one of the best bread bakers on earth, Richard Hart. Richard is kind of a chef's baker. If you've watched the

show The Bear, there's like a little shrine to him at the pastry chef Marcus's

station. And Richard was the headmaker at San Francisco's

legendary tartine which revolutionized crusty chewy sourdough for a generation.

And then he moved to Denmark to partner with restaurant Noma to open his own place.

And you know, I got to know Richard after I chased him for years to write a cookbook.

Now that's finally done.

I can't wait for you to get to know him and his surprisingly

low-key anti-sacred cow approach to bacon.

Hey Richard, it's great to see you.

Hi, Nancy, it's good to see you too. Hey, I have to ask you a question and we've never actually talked about this.

But I was once in a restaurant and the chef said this thing to me I'll never forget he was like hey let me give you a word of advice

Never mess with the bakers because the baker's are crazy

...