When I least want to listen and when I am most frustrated,

I need to actually lean into the conflict,

to understand it better, and understand their perspective better first,

even though they still don't get my perspective.

Hello and welcome. I'm Shane Parrish and this is another episode of the Knowledge Project,

to podcast, exploring the ideas, methods, and mental models that help you learn from the best of what other people have already figured out.

You can learn more and stay up to date with the podcast at fs.blog slash podcast.

It was an or terrible at marketing, but we have a newsletter, it's called Brain Food, comes out every Sunday.

It's short and sweet, full of the best content we've come across all week.

It's worth reading and thinking about it, it contains quotes, book recommendations, articles, and so much more.

You can learn more at fs.blog slash newsletter. That's fs.blog slash newsletter.

Over 200,000 intelligent people subscribe, including most of the guests on this show.

So be sure to check it out.

On this show today is Sheila Heen, an Oman, this conversation is going to blow you away, and it's all about difficult conversations.

Sheila literally wrote the book on how to talk to people about difficult things.

We're going to geek over over what makes for a difficult conversation, how to deal with them, how to think about them, how to avoid them,

how to teach your kids about them, and so much more. If you deal with humans, you don't want to miss this episode.

It's time to listen and learn.

Before we get started, here's a quick word from our sponsor.

Farm Street is sponsored by Metal Lab. For a decade, Metal Lab has helped some of the world's top companies and entrepreneurs build products that millions of people use every day.

You probably didn't realize it at the time, but odds are you've used an app that they've helped design or build.

Apps like Slack, Coinbase, Facebook Messenger, Oculus, Lonely Planet, and so many more.

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