4/8: The Oswalds: An Untold Account of Marina and Lee Hardcover – by Paul R. Gregory (Author)
The John Batchelor Show
John Batchelor
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🗓️ 16 April 2023
⏱️ 8 minutes
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4/8: The Oswalds: An Untold Account of Marina and Lee Hardcover – by Paul R. Gregory (Author)
https://www.amazon.com/Oswalds-Untold-Account-Marina-Lee/dp/1635768217
Merely two hours after the assassination of President John F. Kennedy, television cameras captured police escorting a suspect into Dallas police headquarters. Meanwhile at the University of Oklahoma, watching the coverage in the student center, Paul Gregory scanned the figure in dark trousers and a white, V-neck tee shirt and saw the bruised and battered face of Lee Harvey Oswald. Shocked, Gregory said, “I know that man.” In fact, he knew Oswald and his wife Marina better than almost anyone in America.
After sixty years, Paul Gregory finally tells everything he knows about the Oswalds and how he watched the soul of a killer take shape1
Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | I'm John Batsworth Paul Gregory. My long-time colleague is the Hoover Institution. And Paul and I have talked about this book for years. I've read pieces of it. And now that I have the whole thing, I'm completely confounded. |
| 0:17.0 | I thought I was figuring Le Harvie Oswald out in the bits and pieces that Paul and I talked about over the years. When you put it all together, there are leaps here that Le Harvie Oswald, the immature, delusional, arrogant, and extremely violent young man. |
| 0:32.0 | He makes leaps that you can't see coming. If Paul, if this was a novel, I would say it lacks verisimilitude. So let's get on to what happens next. Your back at school is April of 1963. The Oswalds have been separated. They've come back. I believe at one point, Le Harvie Oswald, Marina was living at a friend's house. She'd been given a place by the Dallas Russians to hide from Lees abusing. He came by, got in his knees, begged her to wipe out the bed. |
| 1:02.0 | She kept, she went back with him, but it's now April 63. And I believe they're living in Dallas. You'll help me, Paul. I believe that at this point, they're living in Dallas. And the night of April 10th, what does Lees do that night and what does Marina make of it? |
| 1:19.0 | The night, Lees did not come home with the usual time. He came home very late, and he was visibly shaken. |
| 1:31.0 | When she noticed that he was not home at the normal time, she looked through his things and found a letter to her, which contained written in Russian, very bad Russian, by the way, which gave her directions as to what to do if he did, if he was not able to come home. |
| 2:00.0 | As I recall, there were instructions about a number of things financial and so forth. He eventually came home around 11. He was quite agitated, very agitated, according to Marina. |
| 2:16.0 | And he confessed to her that he had attempted to assassinate General Edwin Walker, who was a leader of the John Birch Society in the Dallas area. He had fired a single shot. He did not know if he hit the target. |
| 2:36.0 | Marina, obviously, was quite upset about this, about his confession, and told him that he should not, he cannot try anything like this again. |
| 2:52.0 | In later testimony, which is important, Marina did describe the fact that he put like two or three weeks of surveillance into this. So it was a well planned operation, where he was in the backyard of the house. |
| 3:11.0 | She told Lee that this was it. If he tried anything like this again, she would leave him for good. |
| 3:24.0 | And which brings, by the way, an important point, which was that at that point in time, Marina would have realized who he really was that he was to use a Texas expression off his rocker. |
| 3:40.0 | And so the whole thing could have ended there. Had she contacted the Dallas Russians and told them what had happened and they would have reported it to the FBI. |
| 3:52.0 | But she told no one, she told no one, and she didn't write it down. Is that correct, Paul, to our knowledge? She never conveyed the facts of April 10th and 11th to any other person. |
| 4:02.0 | She conveyed them to the Warren commission. Right. |
| 4:06.0 | It's not the assassination. I understand. All right. Now a detail here also, the next month, May is my note here, Paul. |
| 4:15.0 | Oswald starts again, the besieging the Soviets at this point for a visa to travel back to Russia, changes his mind again after trying for General Walker. |
| 4:27.0 | At this point, does he believe he's being pursued by the FBI because he shot a General Walker to see, think he got away with it in May? |
| 4:35.0 | Well, I would say about a week after he tried to kill Walker, he moved to New Orleans, Marina remained behind. |
| 4:46.0 | And it was in New Orleans that he was agitating for the free Cuba committee. |
| 4:53.0 | So he was at that point trying to establish his credentials as a radical operative for Fidel Castro. |
| 5:09.0 | But he wanted to go back to Russia. Did he? |
... |
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