Hey, no judgment, I guess a little bit of judgment.

I'd say more than a little bit of judgment.

Hey!

I'm Antelope Dukworth.

I'm Stephen Dubner.

And you're listening to no stupid questions.

Today on the show, when it comes to success,

is talent or effort more important?

It's so interesting.

And I sometimes say out loud, I will never get bored of this.

Also, what's the issue with using acronyms like POTUS or SCOTUS?

Gosh, I didn't really like the sound of that when you just said that.

I was like, ooh!

That's a little too much like SCRODUM.

Angela, on this thing called the internet that I was wandering around the other day,

I read a five-year-old paper of yours called The Mechanics of Human Achievement.

I like that paper.

I did too, it was really interesting, and I thought it would be fun to talk about.

So I guess my question today would be when it comes to achievement, what's the best

way or a fruitful way to think about breaking down talent versus effort?

So I wrote that paper with a computer scientist, Lyle Unger, and also somebody who had been a

physicist before he was a psychologist, Johannes Eichstert.

...