I'm Tom Bass with Cleopascal on the foundation for the defensive democracies who's helping

me understand the vast canvas that is Oceania, the island, some independent, some part of the

U.S., some under the protection of the U.S., some sovereign, some connected with France

or Australia or the United Kingdom.

But the PLA is pressing its advantages wherever it can find it and now we go to the federated

states of Micronesia, a former president, Panuelo, has updated everyone on what he believes

to be Chinese malign activity in the FSM.

This is an interview done by a foundation for the defensive democracy visiting Adjunct

Fellow Richard Clark.

Cleo, what I learned is that there has been a Chinese research vessel entering the waters

of the FSM without permission.

How does that connect to former president Panuelo's doubts about what China is doing and

what the present government is doing about it?

When he was still president in March 2023, he wrote a letter that's become widely cited

where he described the Chinese research vessels going up and down the undersea cables,

which are used for, of course, sensitive communications as well as other forms of just

general email and things like that.

This is clearly continuing.

To deal with that kind of a threat, he said when he was president to the organizations

with a discovery, a cyber intelligence bureau, which would look at things like this and

an information intelligence service, which would help him get intelligence from allies

to better understand his security environment, his country's security environment, because

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