I'm John Bachelor visiting with two professors of epidemiology who are helping me

understand there's a direct relationship between prosperity and health and

conduct, rules, law and order, all of that.

I'm thinking of the homeless of California a result of income inequality.

What is to be done?

Professor Richard Wilkinson, Emeritus Visiting Professor of Social Epidemiology, Department of Health Sciences,

University of York, University of Nottingham,

Orthumbia University and University College.

That's a whole lot of smarts.

And Kate Pickett, Professor of Epidemiology, Department of Health Sciences, University of York.

Professor Wilkinson, I start with you.

Your first recommendation is, I guess, what you'd say say recognize something must be done because there's a whole lot of people

in this country who would argue that's liberty for you.

What is it that we can do immediately in the United States to begin to redress this historically

getting worse problem?

We have to reduce inequalities both in income and wealth. They both matter.

And really this problem has run away with us since about the late 1970s or 1980. Our societies have changed and become

more antisocial. There are two ways really of reducing income inequality.

One is to redistribute income through taxes and benefits.

They have been dramatically reduced at the top income levels since 1980.

But we also have to make the differences in incomes before taxes smaller.

The main reason why income differences

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