189. Numbers Need Narrative: Use Data to Influence and Inspire

Think Fast Talk Smart: Communication Techniques

Think Fast Talk Smart

Communicating, Influence, Career Skills, Career, Business, Education, Leadership, Careers, Communication, Career Growth, Public Speaking, Language Learning, Improv

4.7 • 711 Ratings

🗓️ 4 March 2025

⏱️ 21 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Why numbers are only as compelling as the narratives we attach to them.

Facts and figures can be your friend, but before you load your presentation full of data, Miro Kazakoff has a word of caution: “Data’s objective, but people are not.”

You might think that your data speaks for itself, but Kazakoff says numbers need a narrative. A senior lecturer at MIT Sloan School of Management and author of Persuading with Data: A Guide to Designing, Delivering, and Defending Your Data, he says the key to making data persuasive isn't about showing more information — it's about understanding your audience well enough to know how to relay it in a way that will connect with them. "The people who get good at this are not so much the people who can talk and draw graphs well, but the people who can listen the best. It starts with is empathy.”

In this episode of Think Fast, Talk Smart, Kazakoff joins Matt Abrahams to explore how to transform complex data into clear, compelling communication. From avoiding the "curse of knowledge" to effectively orienting your audience through visualizations, he shares practical strategies for making your data not just informative, but persuasive.

Episode Reference Links:

Miro Kazakoff
Miro’s Book: Persuading with Data
Ep.49 Make Numbers Count: How to Communicate Data Effectively

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Matt Abrahams >>> LinkedIn

Chapters:

(00:00) - Introduction
(02:14) - How to Use Data Persuasively
(04:01) - The Curse of Knowledge in Data Communication
(06:26) - The Best Way to Present Data Visually
(08:41) - The Role of Context in Making Data Meaningful
(10:53) - Orienting Your Audience When Presenting Data
(13:29) - Storytelling in Data Communication
(15:30) - The Final Three Questions
(20:29) - Conclusion

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Transcript

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0:00.0	Feel like you aren't being challenged or growing at work?
0:03.5	Podcast listeners and my students often ask me, when is the best time to make a career move?
0:09.0	I always tell them that the best time to look for a new job is when you're feeling too comfortable in your current one.
0:15.0	LinkedIn should be your first stop when looking for something new or just seeing what's out there.
0:20.0	I regularly use LinkedIn
0:21.6	myself, and I see how it has helped many others I know. LinkedIn has just made the job search
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0:45.4	lifting so you can find your ideal fit. Explore your job potential at LinkedIn.com slash jobs.
0:51.8	That's LinkedIn.com slash jobs.
0:55.1	When it comes to communication and persuasion, numbers can be your friend.
1:01.3	But you don't want to use numbers in a way that numb your audience.
1:06.0	My name's Matt Abrahams, and I teach strategic communication at Stanford Graduate School of
1:10.7	Business.
1:11.6	Welcome to Think Fast, Talk Smart, the podcast.
1:15.4	Today I am excited to speak with Miro Kazakov.
1:18.8	Miro is an author, entrepreneur, and senior lecturer in managerial communication at the MIT
1:24.3	Sloan School of Management.
1:26.2	He is the recipient of the MIT Sloan Teacher of the Year
1:29.0	Award and is also the author of Persuading with Data, a guide to designing, delivering, and
1:35.1	defending your data. Mero, welcome. I look forward to our conversation. We've known each other for a while,
	...

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