Hello and welcome to another episode of the Secular Buddhism Podcast. This is episode number 126.

I am your host Noah Rochetta and today I'm going to talk about finding peace in the midst of chaos.

As always keep in mind you don't need to use what you learn from Buddhism to be a Buddhist.

You can use this to learn to be a better whatever you already are.

So let's jump right into the Zenko on my share at the end of the last podcast episode.

Two monks were arguing about the temple flag waiting in the wind.

One said the flag moves. The other said the wind moves. They argued back and forth but could not agree.

Queen Ang the sixth patriarch said gentlemen it is not the flag that moves. It is not the wind that moves.

It is your mind that moves. The two monks were struck with awe.

I think this co-on is very appropriate with the topic of the discussion today and quite honestly with the observations that we make on almost any argument that you see on the topic.

On social media or in person. You just picture these two people standing there arguing about whether it is the wind that moves or it is the flag that moves.

We see that in almost any conversation. Two completely different perspectives. Both trying to get the other one to see what the other one perceives it.

I shared this on the Patreon group and got some thoughts that I wanted to share from some of the people who were in the group.

The first one comes from Saité who says quote okay so my initial reaction was to argue with the monks by thinking the flag and the wind both move. Why did I rush to impart my own judgment.

Queen Ang reminded me why my mind moved. I really like that. I think like Saité it is very common for us to approach this and immediately have our answer and say like Saité said the flag and the wind are both moving.

Of course that makes sense because that is how I perceive it but that is the reminder that what happened was my mind that moved.

I really like that. Thank you Saité. I want to share what Stefan shared in the group as well. He said quote both monks are seeing the same thing and perceiving it completely differently.

Neither is wrong or right. Queen Ang noted that since they were physically seeing the exact same thing the only difference was in their perception and therefore their moving mind was the only variable in the situation.

Yes again echoing what Saité said I think that is a really neat way to look at this. The variable Stefan says is the moving mind.

And man isn't that true in almost anything you can take almost anything this is this is the what's at the heart of the teaching of the six blind men describing the elephant right you have this thing that's the same thing and everybody is perceiving it completely differently.

And that's the that's the situation that we're faced with there's no way for us to be able to make everyone perceive something the same way it just can't happen and you we all know this we know this from any news article any conversation on social media any anything and you're going to have two people come and approach it entirely differently and sure sometimes you get someone who've used it the same way you do.

But we've all encountered somebody who see something very differently from how we view it and and that's what was taking place here that's what what this co on is teaching so I want to share what David said David says it seems that this co on touches perception and interdependence there is an external world out there and we can only perceive through our senses and ultimately our mind so both monks perceive the same object the same objective.

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