This is CBSI in the world. I'm John Batissor. Sudan collapsed into civil war between the

army and what used to be called the Jangerweed, now the rapid mobilization force, the paramilitary

led by two men who are battling across the country, forcing internal refugees and refugees

to other countries in the millions. The question behind this is, who's paying for it?

What's driving it? What is the resolution if any to imagine? I welcome Jonathan Schanzer

of the foundation for the defensive democracies because surprising to me, two of the driving

elements here are the very powerful UAE United Arab Emirates and the very powerful Saudi

Arabia, both with their money and their sophisticated geopolitics and their relations with the

United States and Europe. But the Sudan battlefield is presented as a surrogate contest between

what looked to be friends. Jonathan, a very good evening to you. This is topsy-turvy

for understanding two sides in every issue. The UAE and Saudi Arabia are often on the

same side and remain valuable members of the Gulf Cooperation Council. And yet the

presentation here is that they've chosen sides in Sudan. Is that accurate and why? Good evening.

Good evening. I think that is accurate as much as we can understand what's happening

and it is of course a fluid situation in Sudan. These clashes actually began in 2023, but

the roots of this actually date back to 2019 when the longstanding dictator of Sudan and

Islamist who actually at one point was aligned with Al Qaeda and Iran, he was deposed in

2019. And we went through about four years where it looked like Sudan may have actually

been finally pulled out of the Iranian orbit, the terrorist orbit, and they've normalized

with Israel and things seem to be going well. And then earlier this year in April, we began

to see these two sides begin fighting. We're talking about Abdul Fattal, Borhan, who was

the head of the military and then Muhammad Daghallu, also known as Hamedi, from the rapid

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